TFMF Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 I would say that the Tal Shiar aren't really that covert. Everyone knows who is and who isn't a member. They're really more like the FBI than the CIA. With the Obsidian Order and Section 31' date=' nobody knows who's who.[/quote'] Well the Obsidian Order was lead by one man really - Enabrin Tain and that was a significant weakness. He lead an assault into dominion space. This means that if the founders captured and posed as Enabrin Tain - the Obsidian Order would follow that imposter to defeat. WHERE AS the Tal Shiar could not be infiltrated as if say Kovel was captured and a founder took his place - his men would assassinate him for leading them to failure Also - Section 31 dosn't have any ships, bases unlike the Tal Shiar so really - only the Tal Shiar has power = B) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
queenhank Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 Who says 31 doesn't have ships ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFMF Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 Who says 31 doesn't have ships ;) well i doubt there could be a ship manned by spys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostShadow Posted September 27, 2005 Author Share Posted September 27, 2005 Rogue was a good book' date=' I enjoyed it (and I'm rather surprised I can remember reading it). However, it's not canon. The only Tal Shiar I can remember seeing or hearing about in the show were those recognizable as Tal Shiar, and we have not been given any evidence I'm aware of that there are any others. I'm not saying they [i']don't[/i] have covert operatives, it's just that, as far as I know, we've never seen nor heard from them. Exactley!! :) you never heard or saw them, NO evidince. that is why Tal Shiar is better. And in "message in a bottel" There was a squade of Tal Shiar Warbirds, hell. There was an entire Fleet of Tal Shiar Ships. I would think of the Tal Shiar as its own seperate military and governement, but entailed to serve the Romulan governemnt. In the Eps. "Face of the enemy" diana was captured by romulan activist and made to look like Tal Shiar. In that eps. She played of that fact to scare the romulan military. ANd the captian of the Warbird she served on was B!tching about the Tal Shiar and how the Star Empire Military was better. So this leads me to believe that they are two sepret governments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFMF Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 And in "message in a bottel" There was a squade of Tal Shiar Warbirds, hell. There was an entire Fleet of Tal Shiar Ships. I would think of the Tal Shiar as its own seperate military and governement, but entailed to serve the Romulan governemnt. (see my avatar for details) :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostShadow Posted September 28, 2005 Author Share Posted September 28, 2005 I think that this is now down to section 31 and Tal Shiar. I think that it is obvious that since the Obsiden Order was infultrated and defeated that they where the lesser power of 3 evils. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFMF Posted September 28, 2005 Share Posted September 28, 2005 Yeah - after the events of the attack on the founders homeworld - the Obsidian Order was really defeated and after the events of Extreme Measures - Section 31 lost Sloan so they suffered there - But the Tal Shiar remains strong!!! ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostShadow Posted September 29, 2005 Author Share Posted September 29, 2005 WHOOP :P Yeap we romulans never say die!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostShadow Posted October 3, 2005 Author Share Posted October 3, 2005 I think i found out that the klingons do have an inteligince sector. In the Tribbel eps of DS9 it was focued about a klingon opertive going back in time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFMF Posted October 3, 2005 Share Posted October 3, 2005 I think i found out that the klingons do have an inteligince sector. In the Tribbel eps of DS9 it was focued about a klingon opertive going back in time. hmm.... but then they didn't do a very good job - they were found out by a tribble!!! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostShadow Posted October 3, 2005 Author Share Posted October 3, 2005 lol, yea. I am actualy surprised that they got a klingon to look like a human, even though this is all sci-fi, that is good ahndy work ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFMF Posted October 3, 2005 Share Posted October 3, 2005 Well the klingons had that mutation so it won't have been difficult for them - still it is klingons were talking about.....:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
queenhank Posted October 3, 2005 Share Posted October 3, 2005 He wasn't an operative, he was a rogue. The Klingons don't have enough intelligence to form an intelligence agency. Too "dishonorable" or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostShadow Posted October 4, 2005 Author Share Posted October 4, 2005 i guess, but then how do they know what is going on in the Quad? if they relied on syar fleet then it was a pretty dumb of them to with-draw from the kitimer accords when they did. I mean they where on the edge of a war w/ dominion, why through away there intl? lol. klingons, you cant live with them, you cant live with out them ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
queenhank Posted October 5, 2005 Share Posted October 5, 2005 They probably buy information. It's possible they have an intelligence agency. But if they do, we've never heard of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostShadow Posted October 5, 2005 Author Share Posted October 5, 2005 mabe each house gives the info they have to the high counclie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFMF Posted October 5, 2005 Share Posted October 5, 2005 mabe each house gives the info they have to the high counclie Yeah i find the Klingons way of things interesting (no where near as interesting as the Romulans of course ;) ) - There house system is interesting in that each house can be powerful and have lots of ships and warriors - so the high council has no real control over there men - they follow there house - of course it would be dishonerable and all that klingon crap....:) Speeking of dishoner - I think an intelligence agency for the Klingons would be dishonerable - Why watch your enimies when you can kill them P.S. - Ghostshadow - did you get on IRC alright? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostShadow Posted October 6, 2005 Author Share Posted October 6, 2005 I finally watched the Eps where the Tal Shiar and the obsidean order lead the attk on the founders and it was AWSOME!!! but what i dont understand was that tain was there and he was the Leader of the obsidean order, why wasnt Kovel there? isnt he the leader of the Tal Shiar? But instead it was another colonel of the romulan tal shiar... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostShadow Posted October 6, 2005 Author Share Posted October 6, 2005 This is a cool pic i took of them attking the founders planet. I dont think that even the all might section 31 could have pulled this off, even though they whernt sucsessful it was still original. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFMF Posted October 6, 2005 Share Posted October 6, 2005 Yeah - the Tal Shiar must be on good terms with the romulan empire cause otherwise - i don't know where they'd get the resources to build that fleet - unlike section 31 where no one knows who they are Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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