GhostShadow Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 No' date=' i saw the beating w/ my one eyes[/i'] Are you saying the parents beat their kid if he didn't act "gay"? I think we can all agree that qualifies as abuse. But lets not stereotype these folks as representing all gays. After all, its far more likely for a drunken father to beat a daughter for acting "slutty" too. A lot of bad parents out there of all varieties. Did you read what i said...? i said that he was beat by a group of Neo-Nazi fanatics..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostShadow Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 I dont think it is right for a parent to "teach their kid to be gay" I don't think its even possible. The case of John/Joan seems to have proven that sexual identity isn't something that is simply taught. I think it is possible, in certain cases, that there's more than one way to become gay. From what I know, however, it's extremely unlikely that any gay couple would try to interfere with their child's development, one way or the other. I certainly do not believe that simply having gay parents is going to make a child gay. I too think that is posible to be taught gay... If you are surounded by a certian enviroment you will adapt, coap, and learn to function in it. It is simple biologly. IF a young child grows up being taught what to do... he is gonna have a second skin to it. it will become natural to HIM, even though it is not Natrul in Nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruk Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Did you read what i said...? Yes, I read what you said. But Beawulf asked you "I'm curious if you you actually witnessed any of this conditioning or if you only heard hear-say?" The conditioning being the parent's teaching their child to be gay, which is why I was wondering to what you refered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostShadow Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 yeah, i knew the kid. his parents where shiffty..... I went to his house once w/ some friends.... i didnt go agian.... they had naked pictures of men... amoung other things i would like to forget.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StitchInTime Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 I think the discussion is going just fine in here :P I dont think it is right for a parent to "teach their kid to be gay" I don't think its even possible. The case of John/Joan seems to have proven that sexual identity isn't something that is simply taught. I think it is possible, in certain cases, that there's more than one way to become gay. From what I know, however, it's extremely unlikely that any gay couple would try to interfere with their child's development, one way or the other. I certainly do not believe that simply having gay parents is going to make a child gay. I agree with both of you, I dont think it is something that is or can be taught, or that results from the environment you grow up in. Which is why I was questioning GhostShadow's example. Oops. I didn't say that it couldn't be learned. I think it can be, and that sometimes it is. What I said is that I don't believe that simply being raised in a family with gay parents makes you gay. Think about it: most gay people living today have parents who are straight. I also said that it's unlikely that gay parents would pressure their children to be a certain way, and unless I am mistaken, I think that most gays believe that it is inherent. They therefore would be very unlikely to expect their children to be one way or the other. If they were good parents they would likely encourage their children to discover that for themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostShadow Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 I dont think it matters how many parents preassure their or not, to me ONE child is unacceptable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StitchInTime Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Well, I'd say the same thing the other way: that one child being pressured into being straight by his/her straight parents if the child thinks he/she is gay is not okay either. So, then we'd have to ban those people from having kids as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philly Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Why don't we just ban children alltogether and let the race die out, that way problem solved... But realistically, you can't ban a couple from having children, at least not in a democratic society. Also i dont thing a license to have children wouldn't fly either again at least not in a democratic society. What would Cletus have to say about that one i wonder.... "Hey Brandeen they done want us to get a cert-tif-i-kite ta has us more ungins" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StitchInTime Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Why don't we just ban children alltogether and let the race die out' date=' that way problem solved...[/quote'] Sounds good, but could be tough to implement. ;) Or, we could just issue 'breeding' licences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philly Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 ^^ re read post again lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TetsuoShima Posted November 18, 2005 Author Share Posted November 18, 2005 So are you basically you are only for "natural" pregnancies I take it? Does this mean you likewise are against birth control and other methods that aren't natural? Yep and nope. I do think that natural pregnancies is the way to go if you decide to have children. If that fails, you could adopt children. And well, actually, you could even adopt children if you can have children of your own (whether you actually have or not)... As far as raising children is concerned, it might be a good idea to have parents (-to-be) follow some sort of course to help them on their way, to help them set the first steps on how to be a good parent. But at least in my own environment, people seem to at least try to do that all by themselves, by reading books and asking advice from their parents and other people they trust... So actually making it some sort of obligation might not be necessary, I can't speak for other environments though... I am not at all against birth control, that is a very good thing imo. Mostly because of social reasons (all of which can be argued against and for), for example: how is someone going to be a good parent if he/she doesn't at allwant to be a parent. Also the natural pregnancies is mostly because of social reasons (no need to create even more children if you naturally can't have them, there are plenty of other children out there that can use good parents and are in need of foster parents, of course, you could say: so you're going to have people who have allready the unfortune of not being able to have children of their own, clean up the dirty work of other people... And I would say, it is indeed not entirely right, but I think the people in question would be happy to raise a child, even if it is not their own. Also, having a child in non-natural way (depending on the reasons for not being able to have one), can be a costly process, as such it would discriminate poor versus rich. Another thing, while we're at it, if you make it so that they could have children (not worded entirely as it should, but you know what I mean), why not immediately also make it so that they select the 'potential' children so that only the very best will be (excuse me not using the proper term, but I can't come up with it at the moment) 'inplanted'/'fertilised' or even further, why not immediately adapt them so that they don't have certain defects that we can remove or even 'improve' them,... You see, once you go down that road, where to draw the line, some wil say here, others will say over there, which line will it be and why choose this one over that one,... In the end people will stil not be happy because the decision made will not represent everybody... As you see, I have a slight moral issue with it as wel, but well, each persons morals is something they usually decide for themselves based upon the environment they grow up and live in among other things, so you could discuss it, but it would not really change anything in most cases... So you see, in this case, I'd just let nature have it's way and select 'the breeding process' for us, at least untill we've completely resolved our own issues. Now all I said above is completely my own personal point of view and should only be treated as such. If at one point or another somebody decides they don't feel the same (which I'm certain they will, actually, I believe in most countries artificial pregancies are completely ok, in mine too I think), I will not go on a crusade against them. But should that misfortune (if I can call it that) ever happen to me, then I will not try to have children with the help of a lab. I would either not have children at all, or I would try to adopt one. But as I said, that's just my point of view, I don't know if it's popular one or not (though I imagine it isn't), but that is no reason for me to change it. Hope I made at least some sense in my explanation... :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostShadow Posted November 19, 2005 Share Posted November 19, 2005 Why don't we just ban children alltogether and let the race die out, that way problem solved... But realistically, you can't ban a couple from having children, at least not in a democratic society. Also i dont thing a license to have children wouldn't fly either again at least not in a democratic society. What would Cletus have to say about that one i wonder.... "Hey Brandeen they done want us to get a cert-tif-i-kite ta has us more ungins" well if we cant ban them, we can educate them, that is all i am saying. we need to educate our countries, our parents, and most of all; our children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
str82u Posted November 19, 2005 Share Posted November 19, 2005 Well, look how China got about limiting the size of families, I don't think anyone should be denied the right to have children, the downside is that sometimes we can't root out those who will become abusive or worse. We have to do what we can to protect children, of course, but to licence people or certify them just to have kids isn't "right" Case in point, my own, my ex-wife has actually taken me to court to get my girlfriend (who is 36 and has two healthy happy teenagers living with us) to take the same parenting skills course to keep on the same page with raising our 7 year old. Now I don't have the energy to tell the whole story, but have faith that I'm being honest enough to say that it's all a matter of control and I can't have my daughter overnight until this is done, and we're talking 10 sessions at $90 a session. It boils down to this for me: There are more people like my ex in the world than there are people like us, give a moron power and that moron will screw up so much just for the sake of using that power. I don't care for Homosexual couples having children as a couple, but I would say that controlling those people or making them go to lengths the rest of us might not normally have to is worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest c4evap Posted November 19, 2005 Share Posted November 19, 2005 Well, so far I've managed to stay out of this discussion (for the most part). Some very interesting comments I must say. However, I was wondering, what about transgendered people. What I mean is...what about adoption for a couple - one of which was formally a man or woman? Has anyone given any serious thought to that scenario? c4 :thinking: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S0V13T Posted November 19, 2005 Share Posted November 19, 2005 Hey, imo c4, as long as the transgendered parent isn't a crack addict, and raises the kid right, there shouldn't be a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TetsuoShima Posted November 19, 2005 Author Share Posted November 19, 2005 Hey' date=' imo c4, as long as the transgendered parent isn't a crack addict, and raises the kid right, there shouldn't be a problem.[/quote'] I second that motion. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest c4evap Posted November 19, 2005 Share Posted November 19, 2005 Hey' date=' imo c4, as long as the transgendered parent isn't a crack addict, and raises the kid right, there shouldn't be a problem.[/quote'] I second that motion. :) But a hetro person who is a crack addict can have a kid so what's the difference? :p c4 ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruk Posted November 19, 2005 Share Posted November 19, 2005 But a hetro person who is a crack addict can have a kid so what's the difference? And the state often takes them away if the parent is found to be unfit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest c4evap Posted November 19, 2005 Share Posted November 19, 2005 But a hetro person who is a crack addict can have a kid so what's the difference? And the state often takes them away if the parent is found to be unfit. True enough but they aren't stopped from having children. Maybe they should be...but that's another topic I think. c4 B) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcant Posted November 19, 2005 Share Posted November 19, 2005 Well, so far I've managed to stay out of this discussion (for the most part). Some very interesting comments I must say. However, I was wondering, what about transgendered people. What I mean is...what about adoption for a couple - one of which was formally a man or woman? Has anyone given any serious thought to that scenario? c4 :thinking: anyone who was dealt a wrong chromosonal hand at birth and endured all the travails they had to. to correct natures little joke is what ever sex they were meant to be and should be treat the same as anyone else of the gender they were meant to be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now