Babylon 5

[Tenebrae]

The CGI for B5 was better than what Star Trek offered - sure now it looks dated but guess what chubby, look at the Trench Run scene from ANH, over 20 years later IT LOOKS DATED. Goodness me, the passage of time... who could imagine it.

[haggis]

the cgi was very well done ....

 

You can't be serious.

 

i am ;) .... as said it was good for 13 years ago

[Cypha01]

Please' date=' Crichton himself had more emotional resonance then the entire 5 seasons of Babylon 5. It might not of completely taken the science in science fiction seriously, but neither does Galactica. I empathized more with puppets in Farscape then I ever did with Dr Franklin or Ivonova. As for Firefly, you're actually the first person I've heard say Firefly was awful. [/quote']

 

I completely disagree, the characters in B5 were actually realistic and had weaknesses and personalities. Farscape was merely Blakes7+Buck Rogers+Pretty effects = Farscape. I found Chriton to be very 1dimensional and cliche of the American hero mold. But then when they have such pretty effects to back the series up, its no wonder people forget the storylines and acting. Its just doing a "star wars". Firefly was innovative but boring, and the whole anti-hero thing has really been done to death.

 

Buck Rogers wasn't awful' date=' that is if you possess the ability to take the show for what it was and not evaluating it on some criteria of what you think each and every sci-fi show should be.[/quote']

 

BR was fun, camp and cheesy. I enjoyed it as a child.

[jasperchc]

about the 6 B5 movies, including the legend of the rangers, i wanna watch them with series 1-5, can someone tell me where each of the movies fits in the series? especially the time line, i wanna get them right. thanks.

[Cypha01]

@Jasperchc,

 

watch "The Beginning" first , ''The Gathering'' 2nd, "A Call To Arms" is set during Season 03/Season04 in The Shadow War and I would watch "Legend of the Rangers" last. Sorry, not to sure exactly where the others fit in. Hope that helps somewhat though..

[jasperchc]

the beginning come before the gathering? i though the gathering was the pilot movie? and anyone knows where thirdspace and the the river of souls fit in the series?

 

[diegote]

to Crewman Xevallah, first change you pict, then discuss about b5.... yeap, b5 its not perfect, maybe far from it... but you cant compare it with farscape, firefly and odyssey 5.... firefly was junk, everybody knew it was going to die (soon or later...and it did).... odyssey 5, i should better not talk about that one (madness script, the writer, probably going on drugs...)... Crusade, only last 13 ep, i was expecting at least 4 complete seasons... does anybody knows the cause that made wb cancel it?? i read a long time ago that was some kinda fight between jms and wb.... the only b5 that i didnt like much was the movie/pilot the legend of rangers... my opinion, it didnt have b5 spirit (but ild prefere to watch it, instead some other scifi bullsh&%).

anyway, the donwside of b5 was the unexpected (at least for me) and inconcluse end of crusade.... thanks to this site, i could watch it again.... alltoghether with the rest of b5....

 

finally...about cgi, maybe it wasnt the best..... but lot better than others....

 

battlestar gallactica.... i think its worth watching it... so, Rubus, try to download it as soon as you can....at least a few ep... then tell me what you think about it!

[Cypha01]

I have to admit while I wasnt offended I was rather curious as to why on earth anyone would have Saddam as there avatar...

[jasperchc]

what happened to innocent until proven guilty? the trail is still on going, even though everyone knows what the outcome gonna be, lol. Anyway, i watch the b5 movie in the beginning, its actually set sometime in the far future cause londo is very old already, i think.

[Carlvsi]

I have just read all the posts and would like to add my two-penneth worth.

I agree with everyone who liked the show but disagree with those that didn`t.

Having grown up in a pretty sci-fi household watching all the usual shows like Trek, BR, Blakes7, DRWho, Original BSG(haven`t seen new one yet), Farscape (does Saphire&Steel count)etc (never heard of Firefly or Odyssey5).

I enjoyed them all but, B5 had something different and, please excuse me for saying, a kind of spiritual feel to it. I watched most of the series on tv but they stopped showing it on terrestrial tv so I am glad to have found the almighty niteshdw. I am in the process of downloading S2 having watched S1 and enjoyed it again.

Yes the acting in S1 left a lot to be desired but isn`t that always the way with new series(even Jean-Luc in farpoint looked amateurish), Sinclair was always a bit wooden and that rubbed off on the other cast. When Sheridan arrived people had settled and got into their roles and finally the family was complete. I agree that the cgi was amazing for it`s time as I thought Blakes7 was in its day(ha ha ha!).

I still think that no matter what comes out now B5 will always have ardent fans who will defend it to the death(hopefully not here).

Referring to movies I have seen In the beginning and Thirdspace but not the others and although yes Londo is old in In the Beginning and he is in the future it is really a story about the beginning so I would watch it first or possibly after S1.

 

By the way I have only seen Lost S1 but my theory is that they are all dead and living in Purgatory. :)

[DAmac]

OK, heres the order to watch the movies in:

 

1st :- The Gathering (this was the 2 hour pilot - watch it 1st and understand s1 a little better)

 

2nd :- In the Begining (Watch this 1 right after S1 and b4 u watch 2s. That way u will know what the Black Star is)

 

3rd :- Third Space (watch this after u have seen S3. Other wise u will know 2 much about the Vorlons)

 

4th :- River of Soules (Watch this ne time. It has no baring or Point to the story line) - I didnt like it. Can u tell?

 

5th :- A Call to Arms (Watch this after u have seen S5 and b4 u watch Crusades....... It is like the Pilot to Crusade)

 

hope this helps....

 

 

 

 

Now i have a Question for you all..................... On one of the DVD's of Bab5. They talk about a movie. "The Telepath Wars"............... has ne 1 else heard of it or know where it can b found????

 

[Tenebrae]

In The Beginning actually introduces a number of inconsistencies but it's great for over the top self-sacrifice and such.

 

You forgot "Legends of the Rangers" Which you should never watch. Awful, so awful. If you did want to watch it, it comes after all the others and has no real connection to B5 beyond being in the same universe, being about Rangers (duh) and having G'Kar cameo in it.

[ty9]

*crackle* First time poster, lurked for a while. *crackle*

 

I've just seen the pilot and the first two episodes of B5, and am I the only person to see this show as complete and utter crap? I don't think it's bad (Voyager was "bad"), I don't think it's slow (DS9 started kinda slow), but this show had (has?) such a dedicated following, and it's been off the air for how many years now...8? I see crap.

 

I see absolutely nothing redeeming about this show. Very poor writing. I just don't buy that the humans are a part of a military. Why is the commanding officer flying out in a jet alone? Why is he trying to take down an trained killer singlehandedly with zero backup? Why is he caving to the threat of a single alien ship, with zero weapons (that we know of as a viewer).

 

Why is a spacefaring civ sending a single ambasador (and it's not really made clear what they're representing. Why only four? Are the dozens of other species conqured planets?) To a remote space station (no secretary, no butler, nothing). Why not earth? Why is earth not sending a rep? Or do we send in the military?

 

Why are homeless (quarterless?) people on a space station?

 

Why is (arguably) the most important member of your race hurling petty physical insults in the middle of a crowded area?

 

I thought trek had the handle on non-sensical tech, but those floating cameras really got me.

 

Of course no show gets on the ground running ('cept BSG), but...does this pick up? Should I continue watching?* I've never, ever, EVER picked apart sci-fi like this. I'll buy teenagers with lightsabers, Roman Gods in space, and time machine/phone booths. But...nothing here seems to work.

 

*And I really am asking. The names are the same on a lot of the threads, so I can see what your tastes are.

 

 

[wesireal]

YOOO: is your gripe with the folks on this forum or the quality of B5??????

 

Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder!!! Are you able to understand the last sentence?

[ty9]

Yowza.

 

No gripe against the forum. And I agree, I either like it (the show) or I don't.

A lot of TV shows start out slow. Is this one of them? There are a few negative posts on this already. Wanting to know if the nay-sayers saw the whole thing. (I'm up to three eps)

I guess that post did come off a bit troll-ish, eh. Really wasn't my intention. I legitimately was looking for an answer.

 

[magestorm]

Well, here's some answers to your questions here.

 

The commander of the station doesn't always go out in a fighter. Most times, he's stays home while someone else goes out. However, considering that Sinclair was a fighter pilot for a long time, he'd simply miss being in one. But most times, Ivonova or Garabaldi are the ones going out with the fighters.

 

Now, when Sherridan is there, and going out in White Stars? Well, he's dealing with things that require him to be right there, on top of things. And if he got killed doing it, he had things set up to give others plausible deniability. A commander who feels any real responsibility is loathe to send and lose those under his command.

 

As far as the question regarding representatives, this is something I'm not understanding from you. You question why there are a few on a panel, then accuse the show of not having other representatives there?

 

Simply put, there is a present day example to Babylon 5, in the United Nations. Each country sends ONE representative, to work with that group. However, there is a panel of the biggest countries who sits on an advisory councel, making things more streamlined for most decisions. This is why there is the Advisory councel, then the League of Nonalligned worlds. The League has one collective vote for the council on some issues, while on other matters each having their say in matters.

 

All humans in the military? Huh????? That's not what I gathered. Yes, you do have many humans in the military there. Considering this is considered a diplomatic station, with a military govenor in charge, and providing defense against raiders, and enforcing neutrality, there would be a significant military presence on the station. But, there's human shopowners. There's civillians all over the place. I just don't see how you get the idea that the military owns everyone.

 

Ok, ther is the Psi Corps. But, that's only for humans that are telepathic, and that is a requirement by human laws to do this, to protect other's privacy. But every man woman, and child in the military? Nope.

 

Ok. Homeless on the station. This alone was explained several times in the show. The economy for Earth and it's colonies and outposts are driven by money. People would go to these places and try to start a new life, or have promises of a job. Now, we know in real life these things don't always work out for the better. Hell, you see some wind up in dire straits because they miscalculated the cost of living at a place, or the job didn't happen, or other things.

 

These lurkers, for whatever reason, went to B5. Once there, things happened to where they didn't make it. Often, these people just didn't have enough money for a return ticket to where they came from. So they would find areas of the station that weren't finished yet, or were finished and just unused, and would scratch out a living as best they could, or at the least try to survive.

 

To me, the show is a lot more realistic than others of how the future works. Star Trek pointedly states they don't worry about cash. So how does one get repaid for their work? So any slob can get any ship they desire?

 

Sorry, Star Trek is good. But it fails to take into account the laziness, greediness, and hornyness of the common human. Hence, as Scott Adams says, real life can never be like Star Trek.

[ty9]

First off, thanks.

 

1. I was a bit weary of seeing a commanding officer in harms way week after week. I just haven't seen it yet (I'll try more)

2a. I gathered that the alien council were all major powers in the universe at one time or another. (And reference to the Narn doing something unkosher with a few other worlds). The EA has no interest in diplomatic realations with the other worlds. OK. I'll have to assume we'll find out what's going on here at some point (I completely missed the League of Non Aligned Worlds

2b. So Sinclair is the human rep?

3. Having a military operated station of that size with with civilian ventures on it makes complete sense. And yeah, traveling off for work also makes sense. But we've got homeless folk and dope dealers inside of the UN building. Minor security risk.

4. I like the Psi-Corps. Makes sense that they are regulated so heavily. And HOW.

5. The utopia that is star trek works (for me), due to the backstory (we all know it, blah blah). It takes place so far in the future that that humans are quite alien themselves. But human nature being what it is. I could easily see it not changing, I have no problem with that. Makes things that much more down to earth.

 

Nothing I hate more in a TV show/Movie than having something spelled out for me (waste of time, and ambiguity is sometimes fun). I'm just left guessing at a lot of this.

 

I Can't really compare this to another show, since I've only got four hours in. I'll try a bit more.

I'm just to figure out what the frak I'm missing.

 

[Carlvsi]

Here, here magestorm. Well explained.

I wholeheartedly agree.

 

As has been touched upon, very few series(if any), let alone sci-fi have everything sorted out in the first season. If this is what you want then steer clear of sci-fi.

If we all gave up watching at the first sign of problems, then I think that most series wouldn`t get past season one, including Trek.

Although I haven`t seen the new BSG I`m sure I could come up with inconsistencies that other fans of the show would disagree with. As I am also sure that many people who remember, like me, watching the original may disagree with certain aspects. It`s a matter of suspending disbelief and getting into the larger picture. As well as giving it time!!!

 

As previously mentioned I love B5, but I did think that the Actor playing Sinclair was a bit wooden, I was able to see past this and keep my eyes on the show itself. I enjoyed the concept of the show, it was different to Trek in many ways.(especially as all you had was TOS and TNG). It was more linked to modern civilisations and not future ones. Yes they have more tech, but the problems they survive can, as with other sci-fi, could be related to our lives.

 

Also with regards to Commanders/Captains going out flying around, this is also mentioned in S2 by Sheridan that he has to keep his flight time up. I am pretty sure that this is the same today. Anyone who holds a fliying licence, no matter what rank, they have to go flying every once in a while to retain their licence and flight pay.

 

We even have our own version of lurkers, how many homeless people in the worlds capitals are there because they wanted to start affresh, realised the streets weren`t paved with gold, and couldn`t afford to get home or didn`t want to.

 

Not so far fetched now!! ;)

 

Anyone expecting everything to make sense on tv should stick to the news, but even that is debatable. lol :p

 

My suggestion is to watch the first two seasons(possibly also Thirdspace, it may whet your wistle), then make up your mind. If you still don`t like it then we won`t hold it against you. :D

[magestorm]

No problem. I'll try to answer these other questions or comments.

 

Many times, you see the commander send out ships. Yes, he occasionally goes himself. Especially when the situation has a diplomatic issue to handle as well.

 

The alien council is seperated between the major powers and the smaller ones. The Narn, Centauri, Vorlon, Mimbari, and Humans are the major powers in the area, just like the US, China, Rusia, and European powers sit on the UN council. The League of Nonaligned Worlds are like the other countries in the world. Earth does have diplomatic relations with the League planets, just as the US has diplomatic relations with Brazil, Argentina, New Zealand, etc.

 

Yes, Sinclair is the human representative. When they were building Babylon stations, after the Earth- Mimbari war, the Mimbari would only join on it if they got final approval of the Earth representative. While Sinclair was on the list, he was waaaaaaay down the list. But, the Mimbari turned down each and every one till Sinclair came up for nomination.

 

Remember, Babylon 5 is a muti use station. it is used as:

1. Military base of operations only for protecting shipping lines and the station

2. Negotiation base, designated neutral territory, so that two warring races can meet and negotiate a peace.

3. A trading port, for governments and for private people.

 

Now, notice that there are sections of the station that are off limits to just normal people. You have an ambassadorial section, where Joe Schmo can't just wander in. You don't have dope dealers and homeless people just wandering the station willy nilly. They stick to unused sections, while ambassadors usually stick to their areas.

 

The thing that really irks me is just how Star Trek seems to revise history. You have one history going along just fine and dandy. Next we know, that history is chucked out the window, and replaced with another, seemingly at will.

 

But, I do like both. Just because I don't like what some stiff in a suit decided to do with a show's history doesn't detract from the rest.

[Anonyman]

Crusade' date=' only last 13 ep, i was expecting at least 4 complete seasons... does anybody knows the cause that made wb cancel it?? [/quote']

 

TNT requested ridiculous ideas: "Can we lose the makeup on Dureena (our resident alien character) and make her an alien by her attitude?""

 

TNT: "We'd like to have one of the characters include a sexual explorer, so when they make contact with a new race, his or her job is to go and have sex with them."

 

TNT: "We'd like to see an episode worked around a wrestler, since wrestling is hot right now."

 

TNT: "We think you should give the captain a dog for a pet."

 

 

 

JMS: "Every day there was a campaign of attrition (including wanting the Captain to rape a crewmember), and the constant threat that if things weren't done, either the first shut-down would be permanent, or there would be another shut-down. The show was essentially held hostage."

 

JMS refused to work under those conditions. He left. End of Crusade.