beckorro Posted January 24, 2006 Share Posted January 24, 2006 Hello! Hated to start a new topic for this, but hey, we're all here for the basic reasons. Obviously, being a hard core fan for about 20 years, I "have" most of the episodes. I know some episodes are missing and others are ...essentially... missing. For example, episodes 18 through 31 are either unavailable completely or only available as reconstructions (generally via Loose Cannon ...thank God, etc....). I know that many of the early episodes were "trashed" by the BBC. Okay, so much for the obvious. Sure, some of the so-called missing episodes have essentially become AVAILABLE for most fans because of an active fan base... okay.... So, why are episodes 64 and 134 such difficult episodes? For the sake of all the fan base, let us all know.... Why are most "torrent" fans out there missing episodes 64, 134 and basically 9 through 36? Why would we have 146a and 146b, but not 143? I have a pretty good idea..., but hey, I'm a silly American! What the hell do I know? I know there is someone itching to let all Doctor Who fans know about all these, uh, SNAGS, at acquiring a "full" set of episodes. Help the many more-than-casual fans still wondering! Please! Comment! Thanks! --Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underscore Posted January 24, 2006 Share Posted January 24, 2006 Which episodes are you talking about here mate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theaveng Posted January 24, 2006 Share Posted January 24, 2006 So' date=' why are episodes 64 and 134 such difficult episodes? For the sake of all the fan base, let us all know.... Why are most "torrent" fans out there missing episodes 64, 134 and basically 9 through 36? [/quote'] The Doctor 1 Complete, Doctor 2 Complete, and Doctor 3 Complete torrents I downloaded (last summer) from demonoid.com included those episodes. Actually ALL the episodes were included. They were still photos overlaid with cassette or reel-to-reel audio recordings. Fan-made. Not very good stories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beckorro Posted January 24, 2006 Author Share Posted January 24, 2006 Hello again, Sorry for not being more clear in my previous post. Mostly I'm talking about #64, The Time Monster and #143, Revelation of the Daleks. Why aren't these as easy as the others to locate? Why do most episode guides number 146a Terror of the Vervoids and 146b The Ultimate Foe need to be numbered that way? Why do some guides make Time and the Rani 147 and others make it 148? Yes, I understand there are reconstructions of many missing episodes. My post was mostly to try to spur some discussion on why the episodes are numbered the way they are. Pushing Shada into #109 has something to do with all this. Some episodes are missing from seasons 2 through 6. These were mostly thrown away by the BBC in the 1970's. Some are available through Loose Cannon as noted above. The reconstructions aren't that great, but they do serve a purpose --you get to see what the show was about. I doubt most people other than true fanatics know the story as to why these episodes are missing. I'm hoping someone will explain this more fully for others even less informed than I. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underscore Posted January 24, 2006 Share Posted January 24, 2006 OK then... So be it!! :) Yeah as far as im aware the vervoids thing a and b will be because as far as i recall these were originaly to be separate stories, but where then subsumed into the trial of a timelord colin baker thing. This would be the reason for the odd nubering im guessing. As for the whole lost episodes saga, well, ive said quite a lot about it before, but as you asked i'll give you a condensed version. Basically, the BBC was very badly managedin the 50s and 60s and 70s. Popular entertainment was seen as having no intrinsic value to future generations. It was not viewed as something that was particularly of interest. This attitude along with a lack of communication between different arms of the BBC lead to one department junking copies of what they thought were stored by the other. this is obviously criminal stupidity from a business point of view as the reels are worth $£$£$£$£$ now. And even more criminal from the point of view of our cultural heritage. All of the missing episodes were saved on special video tape for broadcast and then after 16mm prints had been made for overseas sales (actually of very low quality compared to the original recording as it everything we now have from the 60s pretty much)the videos would be taken to a special machine with a super magnet where they were wiped for reuse. The 16mm prints were stashed for oversea sales at villiers house, run by an evil slut who proceeded to destroy all of them. this sad story wasnt just confined to dr who, A for andromeda is gone, lots of tony hancock shows, steptoe and son............ theres loads missing even a complete season of the avengers :( Well anyway, i guess you get the picture. If you want anymore details feel free to ask. Theres lots of great resources online about the details of how all this happened. And of course rumours abound that certain rich fans have private collections of missing footage.... thats a wholeother snakes nest! If anyone has the complete Troughton audio adventures i sure would like to see a post of that!!! Have a cool week all!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beckorro Posted January 25, 2006 Author Share Posted January 25, 2006 Hey Chief, that actually provided me with a bunch of info I did not know. Thanks! Additional comments: A lot of this is chosing whose numbering scheme to accept (I currently like Outpost Gallifrey). Notice that the BBC gave up numbering them sequentially! It's irritating, that numbering and naming; for example: Resurrection of the Daleks #134; Revelation of the Daleks #143; Rememberance of the Daleks #152. These somehow get a little fuzzy in my brain and I can't remember which is which; the numbers make me feel dislexic... :cyclops: Yes, the complete Troughton Audio would be welcomed by many members. I also bet there are a bunch of people out there who would really appreciate a torrent of episodes 23, 25, 27, 64, 134 which are: The Ark, The War Machines, The Gunfighters, The Time Monster, and Resurrection of the Daleks (which is currently at 90.5% in most members clients..). These episodes have proven difficult for me to find; perhaps your luck has been better or worse...YMMV Wouldn't it also be cool to get in one package all of the partial episodes like the single reels available for Power of the Daleks and The Underwater Menace (and the many others where only pieces exist?). I'd like to see what is there without the Loose Cannon additions although I am grateful for their dedicated efforts. Okay, I've ranted enough. Thanks again and have a great rest of the week! B) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob43434 Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Russeruction of the daleks is the 5th Dcotor story, REvelations of the Daleks is the 6th and Remembrance of the Dalesk is the 7th. Revelations and the Time Monstor aren't lost episodes. Revelations of the DAleks is available on DVD. And I taped teh Time Monstor of TV two years ago. As for Torrents, I don't know why they aren't available. Just keep looking I guess. As for the reconstructions, I just purchase thee bbc cd's and listen to the audios. I prefer that to watching pictures. With the exception of the Tenth Planet Part 4. Sinc I purchased the video and most of Part 4 is a reconstruction, fortuantly the regenration scene survived! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Potato Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Why do most episode guides number 146a Terror of the Vervoids and 146b The Ultimate Foe need to be numbered that way? These are numbered this way owing to the fact that they were filmed together by the same crew and with the same production number. So they tend to be considered one story. Personally, as they are both part of the Trial and all carry the Title of Trile of a Timelord all four stories should have the same number. The North American DVDs are numbered and Remembrance of the Daleks is numbered 152, if that helps any. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beckorro Posted February 16, 2006 Author Share Posted February 16, 2006 FOLLOW-UP: If you are missing these episodes, get them now. #64 The Time Monster, has been kindly seeded out for a couple weeks and now seems reasonable available in torrent land. #134 is also available NOW (4 seeds last time I looked). :D :D :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jounin Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 i think i saw those eps in one of the "complete" episode packs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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