chrisis1033 Posted April 30, 2005 Share Posted April 30, 2005 I liked the episode and I thought the ending was perfect' date=' Long Live Empress Hoshi! (Hell you could get a whole season out of her manipulative bed hopping and murdering)[/quote'] CHEERS!!!! :D :cyclops: :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbbb Posted April 30, 2005 Share Posted April 30, 2005 Why didn't they kill off evil T'Pol? What about Phlox? What happens to Trip? This episode left too many loose ends. I liked it though, poor evil Soval and more importantly, poor evil Archer. He had too much *** with Hoshi. Bakula really was forcing himself in these two episodes but overall I liked his rendering of Archer's evil counterpart. I was really looking forward to T'Pol being killed, either by Hoshi, Trip or Archer. On a good note it seems that T'Pol would have been killed by "empress" Hoshi anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbsolutPrEvl Posted April 30, 2005 Share Posted April 30, 2005 I said in a post about ep 18 about how they're cancelling enterpise at it's peak.. Yes these Mirror eps are going to be it's peak (fan chosen) episodes.... I enjoyed the first part, it was really NEAT seeing the mirror universe before Kirk's time, and they anticipation I had all week to see the next one that will mostly be on the Defiant... I MUST SAY, part 2 left me feeling CHEATED.. I feel CHEATED! There were more scenes on The Avenger, for F sakes, than I wanted to see... WHY did they not show Archer being phychologically delusional in part 1??? It just SUDDENLY came along... And after the GREAT set up of Archer going MAD, his demise should have been more dramatic than drinking poison... (Heck after the amount of people WHORE-SHI went through, she probably just had to pee in the glass)... What made me feel TOTALLY CHEATED was the ending... Sure I can believe that The Defiant wasn't destroyed and the bid to take control of the empire WOULD be successful, because it in the mirror universe, the BAD GUYS always win... But that was IT? I mean... "Make me the Empress or I blow up cities" bla bla bla and fade to CHEATING BLACK! I just hated the ending.. I ROYALLY HATE IT because they leave it on a cliffhanger... >>>>>>>>>>ON A CANCELLED SHOW!!!!!<<<<<<<< THAT is why I feel cheated.. no resolution and once again B&B have ripped us all off... Archer should have died in a better way, should have shown whore-shi taken out T'Pol after her power grab, Should have shown Trip doing some torture to Phlox engineering style, (since Phlox liked to torture and experiment, Trip could have said, "Let's try a little experiment HMM?" to Phlox before beginning the torture)... All in like scenes rolling from one to the next while whore-shi is demanding to be empress, and ended with whore-shi saying to Mayweather, "Let's give them an example," and cuts to The Defiant destroying a military target in orbit.. THEN fade to Cheating us all black... I just hated the ending.. I feeel cheated for no resolution... Badly written.. (if they publish a book OF the mirror eps, I bet the book would be much better) mind you, Hoshi and mayweather being the most powerful ones in the end, I liked that part, since pretty much, the Mayweather character said like 3 or 4 sentences in these eps, and they totally back burner-ed the character... The hoshi character has had enough, the Mayweather one? Should've red-shirted him like the Tasha Yar character.. coulda WORKED... cancel the show now.. I doubt I wanna watch it anymore.. the PEAK is over... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest c4evap Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 I said in a post about ep 18 about how they're cancelling enterpise at it's peak.. Yes these Mirror eps are going to be it's peak (fan chosen) episodes.... I enjoyed the first part, it was really NEAT seeing the mirror universe before Kirk's time, and they anticipation I had all week to see the next one that will mostly be on the Defiant... I MUST SAY, part 2 left me feeling CHEATED.. I feel CHEATED! There were more scenes on The Avenger, for F sakes, than I wanted to see... WHY did they not show Archer being phychologically delusional in part 1??? It just SUDDENLY came along... And after the GREAT set up of Archer going MAD, his demise should have been more dramatic than drinking poison... (Heck after the amount of people WHORE-SHI went through, she probably just had to pee in the glass)... What made me feel TOTALLY CHEATED was the ending... Sure I can believe that The Defiant wasn't destroyed and the bid to take control of the empire WOULD be successful, because it in the mirror universe, the BAD GUYS always win... But that was IT? I mean... "Make me the Empress or I blow up cities" bla bla bla and fade to CHEATING BLACK! I just hated the ending.. I ROYALLY HATE IT because they leave it on a cliffhanger... >>>>>>>>>>ON A CANCELLED SHOW!!!!!<<<<<<<< THAT is why I feel cheated.. no resolution and once again B&B have ripped us all off... Archer should have died in a better way, should have shown whore-shi taken out T'Pol after her power grab, Should have shown Trip doing some torture to Phlox engineering style, (since Phlox liked to torture and experiment, Trip could have said, "Let's try a little experiment HMM?" to Phlox before beginning the torture)... All in like scenes rolling from one to the next while whore-shi is demanding to be empress, and ended with whore-shi saying to Mayweather, "Let's give them an example," and cuts to The Defiant destroying a military target in orbit.. THEN fade to Cheating us all black... I just hated the ending.. I feeel cheated for no resolution... Badly written.. (if they publish a book OF the mirror eps, I bet the book would be much better) mind you, Hoshi and mayweather being the most powerful ones in the end, I liked that part, since pretty much, the Mayweather character said like 3 or 4 sentences in these eps, and they totally back burner-ed the character... The hoshi character has had enough, the Mayweather one? Should've red-shirted him like the Tasha Yar character.. coulda WORKED... cancel the show now.. I doubt I wanna watch it anymore.. the PEAK is over... Don't hold anything back now... :p Seriously though- I agree. Ending with a cliffhanger??? The Gorn??? There was a TON of stuff wrong with this ep. Normally I'm not too picky...but come on...please... And who's gonna take care of Porthos now??? c4evap :rolleyes: :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karimw786 Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 Hoshi as a power-hungry sex kitten! How can you guys complain? I'd give it 7.5 or 8 on 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisis1033 Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 Hoshi as a power-hungry sex kitten! How can you guys complain? I'd give it 7.5 or 8 on 10. CHEERS!!!!! :D :cyclops: :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skippy Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 This episode was great from start to finish' date=' sure thing it was fast pase, but that was different from a normal episode, that was the point the producers wanted to do.[/quote'] Fast paced does not equal rushed. This was not fast paced...it was rushed (IMHO). c4evap B) Masterful observation, lassie! I love semantics! On another note: I see some people complaining about the complaining. It seems as if some people are a bit put off by the complaining. I think their dissatisfaction with the “not so positive opinions†is misplaced and misdirected. In my opinion, there are two perspectives from which to judge a show. I think that those two perspectives can be clearly understood from understanding how a show is made. I think that the producers of any television show have an obligation to the current fans. They have to create a show with continuity, character development, and general cohesiveness. One way a show can be judged is with these things on mind. Producers of a show also have an obligation to entertain the newcomers of any particular show. These people will be generally unaware of any of the previous storylines and will be overwhelmed by anything that is too heavily dependent on the previous storylines. Ever wonder why they have a minute of previously on (insert show name here) at the beginning of 2 or more part episodes? That's for the benefit of the newcomers to a show. The producers of a show can't make a show too deep without scaring off the new blood. It needs to fast paced; it needs to be action packed; it needs to be entertaining most of all! This is the second way a show can be judged. I also think that these two perspectives from which to judge a show are mutually exclusive and cannot be grafted in ways that do not create conflict. In defense of the complainers (no offense intended): I posit that these people are far more in line with the first line of reasoning/method of judgment I presented. These people have a long-standing relationship with the program/storyline that allows them (if only in their own minds) to justifiably complain about an episode being too watered down/rushed/thoughtless. To say that the complainers are wrong in their judgments on a particular episode is OK when you are judging their judgments from a similar perspective (from a similar long-standing relationship with the show). However, in my opinion, to judge them from a dissimilar perspective (a newcomer's perspective) is just plain unfair, not to mention presumptuous and arrogant. Unless you can judge with purity or provide undeniable arguments/evidence that combining the two above said perspectives is a valid approach, then don't bother to judge at all. Crazed, Absolut, Chrisis, c4... I agree with you all. Did any of that make sense? :thinking: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daffydk Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 I really didnt have any problems with the Gorn. I went back and watched Arena TOS episode. The Gorn back then was made out of a costume and his face was just as reptile like as this one. Sure the Gorn in TOS was slow but they n ever said the whole race is slow. That could have been becuase the Gorn (a captain of his ship in TOS) could have been out of shape :) I love star trek TNG and most of the time there they look at engenious ways to over come there problems. And in this episode, Increasing the Grav Plating intensity was very cool. Its something Jordy would have thought of in TNG, or Belana in Voyager.. or scotty in TOS. The only thing I wouold have liked to see was the Gorn Vaporize, like the admiral :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisis1033 Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 Crazed, Absolut, Chrisis, c4... I agree with you all. CHEERS!!!! :cyclops: ;) :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaiserDay Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 I wasnt too keen on this new look for the Gorn though I did like the ship on ship fights though. Was a bit thrown off by the end and didnt care for the Defiant surviving.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
synexo Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 BLECH! These last two episodes have been a total waste of time. Absolutely no connection whatsoever to the regular Enterprise series. Yes they have the Defiant from TOS, but there was no connection with the actual Enterprise ship or crew. It might have been cool if they did this earlier, when the show wasn't being cancelled, so we could have the hope of some connection in the future, but at this point in the series it's ridiculous. Other than that I really enjoyed this episode, had me on the edge of my seat, except the Gorn really sucked (I actually thought the Tholian was cool), and the ending was a big disappointment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralLee Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 It appears that some need to watch the Original Series episodes..Mirror Mirror' date=' Arena and Tholien Web as well as both parts of the Enterprise Mirror episodes before posting here...LOL..[/quote'] You and others are most correct, and thanks for the background info so far. I've selected the full season torrents of TOS found at the tracker site, and selected those very episodes to download first. I for one, need a review! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLaDio Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 i think there was no need for adding a gorn into the episode i would rather see more tholians :rolleyes: i liked the ending, hoshi killed it just when i was about to say "is this it???" ps: hoshi and t'pol look better in the mirror universe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirdick Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 The Gorn should've been a man in a suit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mezigues Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 The more I watch Enterprise, the more am glad it's cancelled and we can move on toward a new Trek series... that will hopefully be more in the franchise spirit this time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest c4evap Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 In defense of the complainers (no offense intended): I posit that these people are far more in line with the first line of reasoning/method of judgment I presented. These people have a long-standing relationship with the program/storyline that allows them (if only in their own minds) to justifiably complain about an episode being too watered down/rushed/thoughtless. To say that the complainers are wrong in their judgments on a particular episode is OK when you are judging their judgments from a similar perspective (from a similar long-standing relationship with the show). However, in my opinion, to judge them from a dissimilar perspective (a newcomer's perspective) is just plain unfair, not to mention presumptuous and arrogant. Unless you can judge with purity or provide undeniable arguments/evidence that combining the two above said perspectives is a valid approach, then don't bother to judge at all. Crazed, Absolut, Chrisis, c4... I agree with you all. Did any of that make sense? :thinking: Perfectly. I have been watching ST right from the start. I consider myself a big fan and like I said before...I'm usually not too picky. I'm very into Time Travel, and boy could I pick those EPs apart (pick any version of ST). That said...I try to just watch and be entertained. I did like the EP...but I did have problems with it, especially the way it ended. c4evap B) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaiserDay Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 I hope that some day they would clear up the defiant and hoshi thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dabrood Posted May 1, 2005 Share Posted May 1, 2005 Part II was the ultimate Bad Ass Star Trek Episode (even rougher than Part I). This time I can really understand what the "oldschool trekkies" are complaining about... but this is another story, I'll focus on the episode itself. I was really hit by the end: It was so radical and insane - and allows you to think about the possible outcome. I like that B) Besides, none of those "mirror universe" episodes had a "conclusive" ending so you could come back to this fantasy every now an then - that was obviously planned here as well. But, speaking for myself (as allways ;-)) - I love that whole two parter. It's a mind-game (remember: a game isn't supposed to have a deeper sense) and as such it works great. Many many details and it doesn't take itself too serious which is quite refreshing in my eyes. My vote: 8.5 /10 (just too much Braga/Berman-style - rest is fine) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TechTime Posted May 2, 2005 Share Posted May 2, 2005 This was absolutely PITIFULL! The writer/s had to have been on some kind of medication or drunk when they came up with this POS. I grew up with the Original Series (ya I know this dates me some) and cannot beleive that the writers for this present series dig to the bottom of the barrel for ideas. It's an utter disgrace to the entire genre to see such little imagination put into not one but two episodes! As far as I am concerned the writer/s have just given up and are unwilling to look for original material and have resorted to ripping off old ideas. This IMO is a really lousy way for a series that I had such high hopes for, to go down in flames and ended by ppl who have quit on the fans even before the series is over, it almost seems that they want ppl to hate Star Trek and are doing the best they can to leave us all with a bad taste in our mouths. Ya you could say I am REALLY Ticked off! I give it a -8/10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest c4evap Posted May 2, 2005 Share Posted May 2, 2005 I hope that some day they would clear up the defiant and hoshi thing. AMEN! c4evap B) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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